#456514
I agree with Spider on this, They seem to have blamed us a few times if I recall for the products not selling? Not to mention they pretty much came out in a Q&A a few years back and said it was unlikely a Ecto-1 would be in the works let alone say a fire house. Given the surprises we are seeing lately I wouldn't be surprised to see a dream fire house in the works at some point....little joke aside I do believe they have given us "shit" for not buying or showing interest in their products in the past then suddenly call off said products. Hell these are the people that have "sold out" figures and props only to have them re-appear again months or so later. And you can go on their site and order the "sold out" PKE Meter and Peter "only actor remembered in this movie" Venkman of all figures still. I agree fans are not buying as much. Why? Probably cause most of us learned a lesson or two from dealing with matty through out the years. Also there is a thread dedicated to just how much problems they have caused over the years since they accept the licence. I'm not looking for promises, just some quality work by a company that not only sees the logo as something they can make a buck off of but give us fans something we can be proud of too. Guess i'm old fashion that way :).
#456515
Doctor Venkman wrote:Gotta say I'm gettin tired of hearing people bitch about "us getting blamed."

Mattel is a business. If a product isn't going to be profitable because the market isn't there (no matter how much we as fans want it to be) then there is no reason for them to make it. If they have a target profit and the orders show they won't hit that its not "blaming" us. It's the simple fact that the market isn't there.
The market isn't the problem though. Diamond Select had success in selling Ghostbusters merchandise at retail. Neca continues to thrive off selling 80's properties at retail. The problem lies with how Matty chooses to do business and the lack of care/value they put into their products. Why didn't the guys have removable packs from the start? Because it would have cost Matty this extra 2 cent piece of plastic instead of gluing the packs directly to the figures.

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They were also probably banking on being able to gouge people later on for the removable pack versions they should have made in the first place. How did that greedy mentality work out for them in the end though?
#456562
Matty was never selling an Ecto-1.
Matty was selling the idea of one.

If anyone from Matty is reading this, I'm sure you've got your reasons. I don't want to just slag on you guys. You make products I thoroughly appreciate. Honestly, I was elated when I saw the neutrona wand they unveiled at the convention. Problem was, revealing a foamcore mockup of a car next to that couldn't help but lack credibility. It was too much awe followed by shock.

Doubtless the market is flooded with large scale Ectos already. That probably factored in to your decision. Nonetheless, when diecast cars were being developed previously, their respective companies had the good sense to put something tangible on display.

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In the future, if you don't have time to physically produce a prototype of a product, at least have the good sense to get someone to 3D model your goods. Cinema4D is being bundled in to Adobe Creative Cloud these days. Get one of your designers to build a model and comp photos of figures with whatever you're designing. Stop putting Scott in videos playing with a cardboard cutout. Hell, use AfterEfftcs to render a 3D model into a video. The technology exists, and it's way cheaper than tooling and producing a prototype.

Everyone knows your weren't selling a foamcore car -- but you failed to sell us on the idea of what it represented.
#456576
groschopf wrote:Matty was never selling an Ecto-1.
Matty was selling the idea of one.
Yeah, but prototypes cost precious money. And Mattel (like my businesses) isn't in the market t o spend without making anything.

After the success of foamcore Castle Grayskull, I'm sure Matty saw crowdfunding as a viable option for an entire toy, including prototyping.

I'm just not sure how they expected to make that money in under a month after the fiasco with their last big prop (the hoverboard), the uncertainty of the line before its unveiling, and a high cost for a sight-unseen product a year away from release. And the fact the cutout was right by another surprise prop that looks great and comes out later this year.
Kingpin liked this
#456604
Which, in all honesty, you can't blame them.

There's no way the guy was going to actually pay for them.

Well, admittedly (to you guys) I stated all along i would have canceled them,,

However they were done on 2 corporate cards, and 1 personal. My corporate cards have a limit that could have encompassed those purchases.
I am technically a retailer as i have a tax id and pay state and local sales taxes as well as have a physical brick and mortar store; so regardless of my intention of purchasing the final product, there is no reason the order should have been declined.
Now while it may seem an unscrupulous practice, Mattel isn't exactly on my list of friends. I had the last 3 products I've pre-ordered end up being different than what was promised to me. I wanted to see it get made; if i have to be the jerk who falls on the grenade so be it.
After all ,, there was no obligation, if it didnt meet my expectations.

I chose to play there own game against them for the benefit of myself and the entire world of fans especially THIS community.. but yeah I'm the bad guy.

BTW I noticed later in the day after my second order the meter went from 28% to 34%
so I'm not sure what there actual expectations of units shipped were supposed to be,



PS there is ALOT we can blame them for,, ESPECIALLY if they disregarded my order.
Last edited by Kingpin on August 21st, 2013, 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.Reason: Fixed quote code
Ecto-1 fan liked this
#456619
We all knew this wasn't going to get made sadly. It was predicted in Ghostbusters II,by the children at the birthday party " If there's some thing strange, in your neighborhood, who ya gonna call!?"

"HE-MAN HE-MAN HE-MAN"

just thought it would be an amusing post since we probably aren't getting the Ecto, at least not from Mattel : P
portugueseGB liked this
#456645
Ernest Reid wrote: Well, admittedly (to you guys) I stated all along i would have canceled them,,

However they were done on 2 corporate cards, and 1 personal. My corporate cards have a limit that could have encompassed those purchases.
I am technically a retailer as i have a tax id and pay state and local sales taxes as well as have a physical brick and mortar store; so regardless of my intention of purchasing the final product, there is no reason the order should have been declined.
Now while it may seem an unscrupulous practice, Mattel isn't exactly on my list of friends. I had the last 3 products I've pre-ordered end up being different than what was promised to me. I wanted to see it get made; if i have to be the jerk who falls on the grenade so be it.
After all ,, there was no obligation, if it didnt meet my expectations.

I chose to play there own game against them for the benefit of myself and the entire world of fans especially THIS community.. but yeah I'm the bad guy.

BTW I noticed later in the day after my second order the meter went from 28% to 34%
so I'm not sure what there actual expectations of units shipped were supposed to be,



PS there is ALOT we can blame them for,, ESPECIALLY if they disregarded my order.
I say cheers to you for giving it a shot. Based on all the data I've seen I'd estimate the quota was in the area of 2000 for the pre-order minimum, which I personally think is very high considering the cost. I'd have expected a very small run for what they're charging, maybe as small as 500 for the pre-order minimum. It also doesn't seem like Matty was taking the figures into consideration when justifying the cost of the car. I mean if the car gets made most people are gonna want the compatible figures, which is another $100 in Matty's pocket for what's essentially a kitbash of pre-existing parts.
Ernest Reid liked this
#456647
Alex Newborn wrote:Do you know how Kenner would design their Star Wars vehicles in the 1970's and '80's?
Kenner also sold people a cardboard representation of their product Christmas of '77 before it was produced.

Good thing the internet didn't exist back then.
#456669
Troy wrote: Kenner also sold people a cardboard representation of their product Christmas of '77 before it was produced.

Good thing the internet didn't exist back then.
You're right.

Without the internet, Kenner didn't even conceive to use a Jumpstarter style campaign to fund the prototyping and manufacture of their products, and the success of their company relied upon making products people wanted to buy at an affordable pricepoint.

Take us back to the halcyon days of rotodial phones, please.
#456951
The difference between the Star Wars early bird figure set is people paid for the figures. It wasn't a promotion to gauge interest to see if an action figure line would sell. If only a hundred people ordered a set, Kenner was still required to fulfill those orders. While it was an obvious safe bet the figures would do insanely well, Kenner wasn't gonna rip off their customers. They could have charged $7 a figure (which would probably be the modern day $25 equivalent) and had only catered to those who could afford them. Instead they made them so everyone could enjoy them. I think they were either $1-$2 a figure?

Mattel's business approach is the exact opposite to that. They shouldn't have tried selling the idea of an Ecto-1, especially with a foam cut out. If this were before the hover board fiasco and the Ecto-1 were priced $199.99, it would have pre sold rather quickly. However, the timing was bad, the effort was half-assed and the price was too high. Someone said they think Mattel was planning on making 2k units. Mattel isn't going to bother unless they get a huge bulk discount. I'd bet the goal was no less than a hundred thousand. They were looking to hit an unrealistic goal. In the end, Mattel only wanted to produce these on their own terms. They are the wrong company to cater a line to the fans, because their business model excludes any early and upfront input from the fans. A fan based collector line coming from a company to go on record as saying we only speak with our wallets.

Now, thankfully Sony isn't stupid (at least I hope not). When they start to see a growing decline in sales for a company making their product, but while other companies producing the same licensed property are doing great, they'll stop to take a look at a few things. The product itself, the marketing, the customer service and the reputation. Mattel grades poorly in all of these areas. It's easier these days to just go on the Internet and gather feedback from your target audience. Since most of us would probably agree that the bad outweighs the good, it's safe to say Sony wont be too happy with Mattel either. Unless they are contractually obligated to allow Mattel the license, the most sensible thing Sony would be do to is to deny Mattel access to the license. After all, it makes Sony and the license look bad and some companies still care about and value their properties and reputations. I, for one, would like to see Sony ditch Mattel and put the figure line up for bid to other toy companies.
#456958
Troy wrote:
Alex Newborn wrote:Do you know how Kenner would design their Star Wars vehicles in the 1970's and '80's?
Kenner also sold people a cardboard representation of their product Christmas of '77 before it was produced.

Good thing the internet didn't exist back then.
It wasn't two hundred dollars for the sandspeeder, either.
ProtonCharger liked this
#456964
10Dohead: One hundred thousand Ectos? Are you serious? :)

Should we demand Mattel give up the license so that some other company grabs it and finally start making some good GB products?

No, I don't think this is a good idea, here's why:

I saw the movie in 1984 and I bought the very first Stantz, Spengler and Venkman figures in around 2009. I had to wait 25 years for GB figures. During these 25 years not one company was able to grab the license and make something good/reasonable out of it until Matty did.

Yes, there were good promises but they stalled along the way:

- there was a proton pack replica project in the works. It stalled.
- there was a terror dog and a gozer but they're now orphans of that line.

Not very promising, is it? Can we believe it will be better in the future?

Well, it *could* be better in the future, but you must agree that the odds aren't in our favour. And now even less, with this ecto-1 pre-sale failing. Toy raw material prices - plastic, made out of oil, aren't getting cheaper and there's a world economic crisis going. And we must not forget, we're talking a movie 30 years old.

But so are BTTF and He-Man, aren't they? And still they sold...

So I think we actually were *very lucky* to have Matty's GB line and have them bet on a 1/12 scale Ecto-1 to go with our 6" figures...

Me, I am so pleased with my 6" and 12" figures and with my PKE and Trap, which I display next to my proton pack (now 95% finished) and suit. And the Goggles are on their way.
Has it been perfect? Shurely not! But everytime I look at my GB display I can't, for a minute, consider that it has all just been a mistake.

I preordered the Ecto-1, divided its cost by the time available and started saving for it, I really wished to add it to my display.

But then lots of people complained against matty for there not being a prototype. True, but a certain Castle Grayskull was presented too with a foam mock-up, representing just the IDEA of it - and still it sold. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9GpAEhXAmDs)

People complained against Matty, as I did too, that the preorder window was too short. But that certain castle had, too, only 1 month window to hit the goal and in spite of complaints it sold (the goal was hit 4 days before the time was up).

People complained that after the Hoverboard "fiasco" Matty was crazy to expect the GB fans to preorder the Ecto-1. But MOTU fans preordered their castle *after* the hoverboard "fiasco".

People complained about the Ecto-1 being too expensive for what it was - a car that should sell for about 50$. Well the ecto-1 was an all plastic toy, with lots of details by definition (roof rack, interior details) and design (feature list, including lights and sounds and real rolling wheels ;) ), selling for 215$. But that certain Castle was going for 250$ of only plastic detailings, no sounds, no lights, still it sold.

Comparisons between the ecto-1's price and other much cheaper cars aren't very reasonable too, IMO. The Ecto is not comparable to the 60$ batman car in details and features and not comparable to the elite 1:18 (selling for over 170$) in size and in raw material used - plastic is getting more and more expensive these days - oil price has doubled in 10 years. And transporting it from China to the US is not getting cheaper by the day, either...

(read this article, written in 2005: http://online.wsj.com/article/1,,SB1111 ... 15,00.html
if it doesn't show you the complete article, google for "Toy Makers Feel Pinch as Rise In Oil Prices Lifts Cost of Plastic")

and:

"Toy makers are especially susceptible to oil prices. Their products not only use large amounts of petroleum-derived plastics, but must be shipped by sea or air from far off Asian factories, so any drop in the cost of oil should ease pressure on their margins and boost their profits."
Dan Burrows, reporter for MarketWatch in New York, 2006. (http://www.marketwatch.com/story/plungi ... -next-year)

So the Ecto-1 didn't sell. It's an opportunity lost.

If I was "another company" would I want to grab the license? No, because I'd think there's just not enough market. MOTU fans complained too. But the castle sold, so there was a market for it.
#456999
Dan AKA wrote:
Troy wrote: Kenner also sold people a cardboard representation of their product Christmas of '77 before it was produced.

Good thing the internet didn't exist back then.
It wasn't two hundred dollars for the sandspeeder, either.
True. But that seven dollar, nowhere near modern fanboy scrutiny screen accurate, bright orange hunk of plastic that the figures awkwardly fit into brought so much joy.

And all it did was roll too.
ProtonCharger liked this
#457005
Troy wrote:True. But that seven dollar, nowhere near modern fanboy scrutiny screen accurate, bright orange hunk of plastic that the figures awkwardly fit into brought so much joy.

And all it did was roll too.
Well, the hood popped open to expose a "motor" (motor decal) you could put their weapons in; but that and rolling are hardly a "feature". The falcon was mostly a play set that you could fly around, with typical play set features, but it was still pretty damn awesome (which is why i have 3 different ones! and that last one is just beautiful!)

Are we at the point where we resign that mattel wanted the Ecto to fail so they could put the kibosh on the 6" line yet? All the appropriate signs are REALLY there and you dont have to look in between any lines to see it.
#457323
ProtonCharger wrote:
Troy wrote:True. But that seven dollar, nowhere near modern fanboy scrutiny screen accurate, bright orange hunk of plastic that the figures awkwardly fit into brought so much joy.

And all it did was roll too.
Well, the hood popped open to expose a "motor" (motor decal) you could put their weapons in; but that and rolling are hardly a "feature". The falcon was mostly a play set that you could fly around, with typical play set features, but it was still pretty damn awesome (which is why i have 3 different ones! and that last one is just beautiful!)

Are we at the point where we resign that mattel wanted the Ecto to fail so they could put the kibosh on the 6" line yet? All the appropriate signs are REALLY there and you dont have to look in between any lines to see it.
Why not kill the entire line alltogether? Why come out with "neutrino" wand?
#457328
Rodimus wrote:Why not kill the entire line alltogether? Why come out with "neutrino" wand?
While they've had problems with the figure line, they've not had problems with the life-size "replica props". The PKE meter and ghost trap were very well received and sold out.

They then reissued the PKE meter and it hasn't sold out because by that point most of the ghostbusters fans who wanted one had gotten one, even if they paid silly high prices on ebay to get.

The ecto goggles have not had such a great response from fans, but nonetheless they have apparently sold out, a few days after release (rather than a few hours after release as with the ghost trap). It's safe to say they won't have any trouble selling a "neutrino wand", no matter what they want to call it.
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