User avatar
By Venky
#461993
After hours of phone calls and emails, and research, I am presenting the most definitive history of this particular shell. A lot of this info comes from Arron as it started off with him. Along with many things I offer, and invested in and worked hard at keeping it within the community, I offer you this extensive look back at this piece and where it stands today.

It is a large read so I ask you kindly reserve your judgments and opinions until after you look over the entire read.


Statements made in bold outside of the excerpts are mine.

Excerpts are all from my conversations with Arron about the history of his project with the stunt casting he acquired

Numbers above the text are in reference to the image diagram below.


1

(Email excerpt from September 22 and 28 of 2013)


"The original casting came out if the original mold from Columbia studios. It was made after the first movie.

I worked on the pack master along with others I hired along the way. The work was paid for so it's work for hire. That means I directed the work and the results of the work belong to me. The 3 people involved who actually touched them master were myself, Paul Cash (@acme-zenith studio) , Scott Brodeen (@hms). Brent may have helped as well. I can't remember.

The original casting of the pack I received directly from a good friend which I have left out of the story as all he did was hold the pack on a shelf for years and did no work. As for the person who has the origin mold and pull the casting I did not give out that information as its not customary to give out original sources. "


"He made only a few castings. Each made of Bondo and each time he cast a pack the mold shifted and the cuts did not line up. This is why everyone that got a casting eventually ended up reworking it.

This is was discussing the castings made from the Stunt molds. Those castings were either sold or given to a few people. One to Richard Coyle that is the casting I was given, other casting was used by Prosper FX to make the Stunt packs for universal studios. Later the same shop made a reproduction that made its way to Planet Hollywood and was on display. Another pack was given to a very famous Hollywood collector/writer/actor. He had believed it to be original. But it was not. That pack was later sold."

NOTE: Another name, assuming the third person who acquired a casting from this mold is a man named Peter Mosen

(Email excerpt from May 21 of 2013 )

"...Next that person made several castings. I had one, and a few others. One of those did go to another shop but it was not Hms, it was Proper FX. That casting was cleaned up and used for the universal studios packs. And I can tell you for certain that it was cleaned up completely different than my pack. They look 100 percent different. Now proper effects split up years ago. Half of the people went off on their own and that became Hms. My pack is not the proper FX pack. There is no merging of the two."


(Email excerpt from May 23 of 2013)

"The casting came directly out of the stunt pack mold from the first movie. So it is a first generation casting there were no other molds made in between.

This was the source of three problems.

1. The original mold was pulled from a dumpster after production was over. But before it was thrown out someone took a utility knife and slashed the mold. Two huge cuts were made across it. These went all the way through the rubber.

2. The person who found the mold was not an expert at casting. So he use the materials he had to make the castings.

3. He made only a few castings. Each time he cast a pack, the mold shifted and the cuts did not line up. This is why everyone that got a casting eventually ended up reworking it.

(3 castings were made but that is another story.)

So what you will see is that the bottom edge of the pack is curled and bent. And the surface is wavy. Later (at stage 3) to fix this we needed to heat it with a heat gun and set it straight. We would heat a section and clamp it to a plate till it cooled.

Stage 1

At the first stage of clean up I tried to do it the simplest way I could. That was to fill in the steps in the surface and level out where the cuts were. I also tried to clean up the filled in areas around the pipes. The results were not good. And had I kept going the pack would have looked exactly like the first version of the Universal Studios packs.

(As a side note the person who made the universal packs also used a casting from this same mold.)

So after I realized that this was not going to look good I went to stage two as seen I am these photos.

Stage 2

What you see here is an attempt to make the pack a bit cleaner. At this time in history I was lacking a lot of I formation on how the packs should look. Most of the research came from screen captures.

I decided not to remove the filled in areas or rework the entire pack. I simply removed the parts that were not worth saving. That was the center tube with heat sink, the smaller angled tube next to it, the battery tubes, and half of the tower. A piece of particular board was glued to the back to keep the casting from falling apart. Another piece was placed at the mid point of the tower and one more next to the battery tubes.

The tower was cut off for two reasons: to turn it around, and to make the mold smaller once this went back into running rubber.

I would have stopped here but I eventually found new images of the packs. Some were sent by fans who visited PH. Other were from Brent.

These pictures show the pack at the second round of clean up.

I'll need to explain round 3 and 4 later and the story of how I got the pack.

Photos will be sent in another email. "

Whatever happened to the original studio mold?

(email excerpt from Spetember 28 of 2013)

" They ended up at ICONS. And some good castings were made from the molds. I'm not sure what happened to the molds then. I'm under the impression they were destroyed."


Knowing people that worked at ICONS, some being close friends, there was no sign of the castings that came from the mold nor have surfaced.


2

The master as it was cleaned up went through different stages and revisions.


(Excerpt from emails from September 22 and 23 of 2013 in response to Brent's actual involvement in this project )

"The story as described below did not happen.

I believe I had covered the story in a very early email.

The Stunt mold was cut up. It was disposed of by Columbia not Sony. Sony did not own the team at that time.

The mold was pulled from the trash by another person whom in and others know. That person made the castings many years before I took possession. The casting sat in the shop of Richard Coyle for all of those years. I acquired it at the end of the 80s.

I can not give the original persons name but it was not Brent. "


"...about Brent working on the pack. He did research, sourced small parts, reference pictures, costumes, pke, and other bits.
He worked on assembly of the 5 packs and wands with several of us. I don't recall us taking any pictures of each other working. "


3

The mold was made privately.

Five castings were then made for the kits, with a couple of rejects along the way.



(Excerpt from May 20 of 2013)

"...My mold was made by Jim Kenny. A personal friend. And an ex mattel master mold maker. I contracted my mold directly. I dropped off the master and picked up the mold and master. It was absolutely not to related to hms."


(Email excerpt from May 20 and 21 of 2013)

More information on the packs

"Hms only made the metal parts on the packs. The tubes.
The main body of the guns and a few critical parts were made at appled effects. They were made by two great guys. Christian calqhune (check spelling) and Eric harlestasd (check spelling) christian worked on the packs from the second movie. Both followed my plans and Construction direction. Just to note I led all aspects of the project. All construction decisions, measurements, and materials choices were mine.
All the gun parts were made by another machinest. I did the plans for the knobs. Regardless of what fans may think my measurement are correct. I measured of my castings. Just to note all of the knobs on all of the original packs are slightly different. So nothing is correct or standard. The v hooks were made by Brent. The heat sinks were found. They are the closest we could find to the originals. They are one fin off in Count. "

"I dropped the mold off with hms and they used my preferred layup expert. Just name is Paul shmid.
He has done a lot of work in the industry for many years. He also worked at Disney. Currently he works for mattel. "

***To update this statement,... although Arron referred Paul, I later found out and confirmed just last week when I spoke with Larry Reed ( worked on MIB, Dexter and Revolution) whom is good friends with Mike Moore of HMS, that he was the one that cast the shells for Arron. A few rejects were made. The problems with them were "spidering" which is where the gelcoat was too thin and causes the brush strokes to appear on the surface. Numerous distortions and warping would also occur in these rejects. He said the rejects were fixable, but Arron insisted on having new ones made without these problems hence the five that were made for the kits.***


In 2010, myself and two others collectively purchased the entire project among other things.

4


Later in 2011 HMS had a yard sale in which a casting of a pack shell surfaced. It was immediately sold to Ross Arbuckle

Comparing it to an orignal stunt pack from "name protected" he confirmed everything lined up.

This was to believed to be one of the rejects that Larry confirmed laying up.

Arron confirmed recently its one of his....



(Email excerpt from May 21 of 2013 about the reject casting bought by Ross Arbuckle at HMS' "yard sale.")


"The reject in the picture is one of mine. It would seem that Hms sold it. I had asked them about that but they said no. (I don't believe them). "


Ross was told by whomever at HMS that he could remold it. This resulted in the molding and distribution of several sold through the RPF and privately via Facebook etc. making this a 3rd generations casting of Arron's original work.

One eventually made it into the hands of Bob Mosely AKA VideoBob making this a 4th genration casting of Arron's original work. It has been said he has remolded one of his own castings making it a potential 5th or even 6th generation casting.

Another referred to a "poduction shell" made it into the hands of NickaTron props making this a 4th genration casting of Arron's original work.

Other castings have appeared on Ebay under seller names of "Kenobiz" out of L.A., and "propsaganda" out of Canada making these fifth and sixth generation castings.


In conclusion, this is all a representation of Arron Macks original piece, hard work and collaborative craftsmanship.

In relation to this, there is no Production shell nor HMS shell, it is and has always been an Arron Mack shell.



A certain topic was best discussed here in regards to what some of my details may indicate so if you have not watched this, I highly encourage you to.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKPJzuVs ... u:thumbsup

Here is a larger version of the below image

http://i.imgur.com/SBVInya.jpg

Image
Last edited by JoeLuna33 on October 6th, 2013, 2:42 pm, edited 3 times in total. Reason: Removal of incorrect name in "ebay" sellers.
AJ Quick, JoeLuna33, noslliT and 2 others liked this
User avatar
By Venky
#462023
You should put where the shell you are selling fits into the flow chart at generation of that post.

Good point!...

It the same and only mold iI use to this day that made the five kits we bought back then. So it is a second generstion casting that i offer in my for sale thread.
By Larzl995
#462061
"Other castings have appeared on Ebay under seller names of "Kenobiz" out of L.A., "propsaganda" out of Canada and "larz995" out of Utah making these fifth and sixth generation castings."

Just out of curiosity, I am Larz995 in Utah. I am wondering why my name was mentioned, especially in the company of video bob. I don't have a casting of one of these shells or a casting of any other person's shell for that matter. I have seen video bob's shell and it is horrible so I decided last year to build one from the ground up pooling various resources. I first began with Stefan Otto's plans, but very quickly found they they were not accurate according to my own calculations from measurements extrapolated from many photos at various angles (I was given a copy of photos containing the 'secret measurements' by a GBFans member last year to use as reference. I also was given several hundred more pictures that he collected that I also referenced.) I went on vacation in February and I went personally to the Sony Studio's lobby to look at the two packs they have on display. I took photos so I could compare what I saw in person to what I made. I had to modify the 'gun mount' box to fit the angle seen on the real packs. (Most shells I have seen represent this as a box with 90 degree angles where the real one has a small taper on the side where the gun mounts and a slightly more exaggerated taper on the side that mounts against the 'gear box'. After more than a year of careful construction and arguments with my wife as to why I am taking so long and "No one is going to notice or care if it is correct!" I finally completed the master which is solely my work. I am trying to figure out how to post photos of my shell 'in progress'. This is NOT a recast of anyone's work and is in no way associated with video bob!
By Larzl995
#462062
The photos at the bottom under "Other Ebay related castings of the bob shell" show two photos I took of my shell on my garage floor prior to posting the shell for sale on Ebay. Again, this is MY shell, not a casting of anyone else's. How in the world did I get connected with video bob???
User avatar
By Venky
#462063
Hello as it is a pleasure to meet a fellow builder. :-)

Your shell was brought to my attention under a couple of details that appear on your shell that I wondered about. Namely the stunt hose ring above the clippard platform. That detail has been carried over in other people's castings of this shell.

I knew the association of Bob would perhaps raise a few eyebrows and I will correct that in a separate branch of simply "other Ebay shells."


I would love to see your build, master, mold etc. on your project. :-)

Venky
By Larzl995
#462067
I am assuming you are referring to the hole that would be below the vacuum tube? I built the shell before any of the parts that go on the shell and I incorporated this detail since I saw it on the video bob shell and thought it to be correct. Now, I don't know if the hero packs had that hole since it really isn't required and I have filled it in on my master so when my current mold is bad I will make a new mold and the new castings won't have that hole. My only thought was that it might be a good place to run wiring but now know it is not needed.
User avatar
By Venky
#462070
I am assuming you are referring to the hole that would be below the vacuum tube? I built the shell before any of the parts that go on the shell and I incorporated this detail since I saw it on the video bob shell and thought it to be correct. Now, I don't know if the hero packs had that hole since it really isn't required and I have filled it in on my master so when my current mold is bad I will make a new mold and the new castings won't have that hole. My only thought was that it might be a good place to run wiring but now know it is not needed.
That is understandable as he did not alter this feature. It is up to the artistan how they wish to construct their pack, but this is something that as far as we know does not exist on the heroes. Refer to my shell bundle sale thread and look at the inside of the hero shell image to determine it for yourself.



On a side note, I spoke with Larz via pm and assisted him with finding a place to upload images and to start a thread to show his own work to validate everything he is claiming.

I will gladly edit the image when he can show his own original work. :-)
gbrob liked this
User avatar
By Venky
#462079
I'm confused, are you saying the Nick-a-tron shell is a recast? Is the purpose of this thread to share history of a shell or call people out?

My apologies if there are details that are bit vague in my diagram as I am currently working on a revision as we speak. :-)

The purpose of this thread is to provide the community with the proper information of this shell's history leading back to its creation out of the Columbia mold. It will by default debunk any misinformation that I previously stated or others believed to be true.

It is up to those who read and study the material to judge for yourself. I am not pointing fingers, only outlining the lineage of something I currently own and in respect to the previous owner.

Venky
JoeLuna33 liked this
By Larzl995
#462097
This is my brother holding the MDF master. This has an early mock up of and aluminum N-filter which was molded separately. Image

This is prior to making and placing the cyclotron rings. The cyclotron was turned out of MDF on my lathe seen in this photo:
Image

Here is the area in question prior to placement of the base that the vacuum tube sits on and prior to the placement of the clippard valve base:
Image

I will post more pictures in a build thread with descriptions of the process.
JoeLuna33, Venky, abaka and 1 others liked this
User avatar
By JoeLuna33
#462183
Larz I was able to remove your name from the list of Ebay sellers. No worry about being clumped into that group :-)
User avatar
By Etigo
#4916094
WOW!!! :-O
Well, with a few years late, Thanks a lot for sharing this page of History!!! :-D
User avatar
By Kingpin
Moderator
#4919312
A discussion on one of the facebook groups prompted me to take a look back at this thread, and in hindsight Venky's notations do suffer from the respective correspondents not being given any sort of psydonym to identify them, and an absence of a real summary of what he's presented... So with that in mind, and assistance from Aaron Mack, here's a neatend summary of how things appear to have gone down regarding the original Proton Pack stunt mold, and everything that's since spun off from it:


•The original (from this point I'll refer to it as the Prime mold) Proton Pack shell buck and mold were produced by Boss Film Studios, which'd been formed by Richard Edlund specially for the production of Ghostbusters. A modified Proton Pack shell produced from the Prime mold was used as the buck for what would become the Stunt mold.

The buck for the Stunt mold would've featured details that were filled in, and components (such as the Ion Arm, Booster Tube, N-Filter and Filler Tubes) which were installed separately as metal components on the fibreglass Proton Pack shells.
Note: Separate and unique stunt molds were produced for Ghostbusters and Ghostbusters II.

•After production on Ghostbusters was wrapped, the Stunt mold was cut up into four sections and disposed of. (The Prime mold is currently believed destroyed.)

•The quartered Stunt mold was retrieved from the dumpster and reassembled in a workshop not affiliated with either Columbia Pictures or Boss Film Studios. The retriever is understood to have produced three* shells from the reassembled mold, creating the Retriever varient. Of the three Retriever varient shells, each is noted to have suffered from the repair lines shifting during the molding purpose - as a result of the retriever's poor repair and molding skills. The shells from the repaired Stunt mold are also noted to exhibit a distinctive "egg-like" shape to the Proton Pack's Cyclotron, also believed to be a sympton of the retriever's poor skill level.

Image
A photograph of the "Arbuckle varient", note the distored circle of the Cyclotron section.

*One of the three casts is believed to have been acquired by Proper F/X, who cleaned it up and prepared it for casting to create the USF mold for the Proton Pack props for the Ghostbusters Spooktacular at Universal Studios Florida. This would suggest that the first wave USF varient shells were at least two generations removed from the first batch of pulls from the Prime mold.

*Another of the three casts spent a brief period in possession of an unnamed customer, who is not believed to have used it in any capacity, before they sold it to Arron Mack. Arron reworked the shell and commissioned H.M.S. and Applied F/X to produce replacement metal parts. Arron also commisioned a friend who worked as a master mold maker to produce a mould of the cleaned up shell, leading to the creation of the Mack mold and the Mack varient of shells.

•Although contracted solely to produce replacement parts for the shells Aaron was producing, H.M.S. took advantage of the project to either create their own mold of Arron's cleaned up shell, or to create at least one unauthorised pull from the Mack mold. This action resulted in the creation of the H.M.S. varient.
The majority of the materials from Aaron's project would be sold to Neil Ward in 2010.

•In 2011, H.M.S. sells a H.M.S. varient shell, noted as being of 'reject quality' compared to those of the Mack varient. The H.M.S. varient shell is purchased by Ross Arbuckle.

•Utilising the shell he'd purchased from H.M.S., Ross produced a run of shells, leading to the creation of the Arbuckle variant. One of the Arbuckle variant would eventually be sold to Thiago Nascimento, who collaborated with Bob Moseley to create the Thiago/V.B. varient. There have been speculative suggestions that Bob and his team have produced a second copy of his shell, which would give us the Thiago/V.B. varient #2 if correct.

•With the purchased materials from Arron's project, Neil Ward performed work on his own shell in preparation for offering a run of casts through Ghostbusters Fans and The R.P.F., resulting in the creation of the Venky varient.
Due to the issues revolving around Neil's production and handling of his run of shells, he eventually sold the Venky mold and the Retriever varient which had served as the master for his mold to Ron Diep in 2017.

•In 2019, Ron advertised a set of shells for sale through Ghostbusters Fans, leading to the creation of the Diep varient.

•ICONS is noted to have produced a run of Proton Pack shells back in the day, likely either from access to repaired Stunt mold, or from one of the Retriever varient shells. Little else is known about the ICONS varient.


Notations
•At a rough count, the Thiago/V.B. varient shells by Videobob are likely to be no fewer than three generations removed from the production-used shells pulled from the Prime mold. Any claim Bob Moseley and his team make that the shells they produce are "production used" is intentionally misleading.

•Not including shells and moulds produced by Columbia Pictures and production-related studios, the Stunt mold has had the following offspring:

Retriever varient
USF varient
Mack varient
H.M.S. varient
Arbuckle variant
Thiago/V.B. varient
Venky varient
Diep varient
ICONS varient

USF mold
Mack mold
Venky mold

•And a semi-complete family tree:

Prime mold
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXPrime varient (1984 hero/1989 hero props)
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXPrime varient #2 (1989 semi-hero props)
|
|
Stunt mold
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXStunt varient (1984 stunt props)
|
|
Stunt mold (repaired)
|
Retriever varient
|XXXXXXXX|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXX|XXXXXXXXUSF varient (Universal Studios props)
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXVenky mold
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXVenky varient
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXX|
|XXXXXXXXDiep varient
|
|
Mack mold
|
Mack varient
|
|
H.M.S. varient
|
|
Arbuckle variant
|
|
Thiago/V.B. varient

Looks like focus will probably be more on GB202[…]

Ecto grille strobe lights

Does anyone know what these small strobe lights on[…]

Awwwww Snap! My First Proton Pack

Because I am printing the parts for two wands, I h[…]

Find the Bumper sticker.

What on earth is that??? I must have been gone fro[…]